Is the Ufirst Money Merge Account (MMA) a Scam? Read on...
If you haven't heard about the UFirst MMA yet, you probably will soon. There's a new mortgage system out there that purports to reduce your mortgage term substantially by a complex method of using a Home Equity Line of Credit (HELOC) to manage all your finances while advising on when to advance additional prinicipal payments to your mortgage, shaving years off the term. Due to the nature of the amortization schedule for mortgages, in fact, making additional payments above and beyond your minimum monthly payment certainly reduces the life of the loan. However, this system is completely unnecessary and uses deceptive materials to trick the consumer into believing they need this "sophisticated software system" to fulfill their real estate dreams, as I'll show you. I will also highlight how much this will ACTUALLY cost you in the long run, not to mention the other more beneficial uses of your additional funds each month.
About the Company and the System: RED FLAGS
I can't really say I know much about the UFirst Financial other than this system and its agents or "associates". I can say that they employ the usual multi-level marketing scheme that many similar companies do (remember Amway, ACN and the other organizations approaching cult-like fervor in their zeal?) to get footsoldiers to sell a service or system to friends, family and co-workers, entice them to sign on as an "associate" for an entry fee and the pyramid of promises builds from there. A friend of a friend tried to entice me into dolling out the $3,500 for the system and I politely shot holes in his presentation to the point we agreed it didn't make sense for me (that was the easiest "tough sell" I've ever encountered).
In looking for the company on the Better Business Bureau's website, I found something interesting. In sifting through the page of "United First Financial"s that came up, I found that they have duplicate websites. The one that is Satisfactory with BBB is a .net address, while if you Google "UFirst MMA", the .com site comes up. The sites are very similar save for one minor detail. On the .com site (which is the one most commonly frequented by you and I), the company's location is nowhere to be found. On the .net version, which is covered under the BBB, the location is in the upper right hand corner. What's more interesting is if you click on a link to join or learn more, the .net site directs you to the .com site. Guess what else I found? Among the myriad companies that come up in the BBB search, I found one with the .com site listed as its website. Guess what it's rating is? No Rating. I wonder why that is. While this is conjecture on my part, is it possible that the .net site is there to provide for a satisfactory rating with no complaints, while the .com site handles the transactions and could potentially be affected by a poor rating? I wonder. Why wouldn't the site that handles the traffic and the transactions be listed with BBB? I can't think of another logical explanation for directing your traffic AWAY from a satisfactory site TO a site with no rating. Can you?
While perusing the site, I noticed that they make mention of their writeup in "Mortgage Planner Magazine", as if it's a resounding endorsement. What about CNN, Money Magazine and BusinessWeek? These are credentials that the Prosper.com (a true financial innovation) was able to emphasize when it was launching; UFirst can only come up with this accolade? Essentially, there is no legitimate source (major business outlet, famed economist, not even a washed up sports star in a commercial) I could find that would endorse this system.
The UFirst MMA System - Hocus Pocus
Now, for the system itself: It's all based on tricking you into the fear of large numbers by showing you the future value of dollars you'll be paying in interest payments over the life of a loan. In the video example (link below), at 3:00 in to the video, they show an example. On a 200K loan at 6% interest, you pay $1199 monthly, or $431,677 over the life of the 30 year loan. Since you borrowed $200K, your interest payments over the life of the loan are $231K. $231K is a ton of money, right? Well, not over 30 years. In fact, $431K is simply the present value of $200K at 6% interest! Not rocket science, but without an excel spreadsheet and to the uniniated, this really sounds like a scary number. They fail to make any mention of the present value of money. That's where they prey on the gullability of the common consumer. But readers of Everyday Finance won't be duped that easily right :>
At 5:43 in the video, they highlight what happens if you pre-pay $5,000 of your own money into the mortgage. What's laughable is that there's no mention of the $3,500 that you pay for some silly software package. What if you just took that fee and put it right toward your mortgage instead? The video goes on to explain that by using the UFirst MMA sophisticated software, it advises on when to transfer money out of a Home Equity Line of Credit (HELOC) account to your mortgage based on your discretionary spending. If you make 5K a month after taxes and routinely spend $4k, the system will tell you when to transfer the $1K excess funds to your mortgage. Where it seems to be a bit complex is when your spending varies and in some cases, exceeds your income. The system has already transferred funds to your mortgage and the HELOC now takes over so you don't overdraw your account. What gets little attention in the video or the face to face presentation is the fees you'll incur with the HELOC. This amounts to hundreds of dollars per year! When you add the $3500 "software fee" and these HELOC payments, you are now paying "Thousands upon Thousands of Dollars" in future dollars...the same future dollars UFirst quotes when showing the evils of the standard amortized mortgage!
Here's a little food for thought:
Present value of upfront fee: $3500.
Future value in 30 years at 6%: $20,000!
Present value of example HELOC fees in just year 1 alone: $800.
Future value in 30 years at 6%: $4,600
This means for the First year alone, you're spending almost $25,000 in Future Dollars. That's Year 1! While I don't want to beguile you with these large numbers in red, I am simply putting these future value dollars in the same context in which UFirst displays the future value of interest payment dollars. Now, that's a level playing field!
Is Pre-Paying a Mortgage Even a Good Idea If I Could Afford It?
The usual answer is No. At its most basic level, in this environment of low interest rates, you would be well served in investing any additional income as opposed to paying down a low interest rate mortgage which has the additional benefit of a tax deduction. According to Bankrate.com's rates as of May 22, 2008, the average 30 year loan rate is under 6% at 5.8% and the average 15 year rate is 5.36%, which may include points. For the sake of argument, let's say you're in a 30 year mortgage at 6% like the video portrays. If you're in the 25% tax bracket and you're early in the mortgage, the majority of your payments go toward principal, so you're getting a tax break of say, 20% on your payments. On 6%, you're now effectively paying under 5%. Since the long run U.S. stock market average is 8-9% over long periods and with some diversification via international stock exposure, high yield stocks and other alternative investments, you can pretty easily attain a 7% return without a great deal of risk over multi-year time horizons. This is especially true if you're investing in a tax-advantaged account like putting more toward your 401K or investing in a self-directed IRA (I've included a link here to my self-directed IRA account holdings). This is a much better use of excess funds than paying down a low rate loan at less than 5% effective rate.
Even more importantly, if you have any high interested debt, paying that down is absolutely your best investment, as you're not going to earn the 20%+ you might be paying on credit card debt in any reasonable risk-adjusted return investment.
If you do feel compelled to pay down your mortgage early, you could simply do this on your own by making voluntary additional payments as your budget allows, as opposed to relying on this unnecessary system at exorbitant costs
Finally, if you want something easy to cut your mortgage in half, why not just consider a 15 year mortgage, where you're likely to get a lower rate than the 30 year conventional you took on to begin with? According to recent data, the 15 year rates are close to 50 basis points lower than the 30 year rates. Why would you take on a higher rate 30 year mortgage, pay what equates to multiple points in this $3500 fee + HELOC fees when you could simply have a lower rate and a 15 year mortgage, still with the flexibility to pre-pay as you see fit?
I wish I wrote this article sooner, but I was awaiting completion of my documentation outlining my blog as a Limited Liability Corporation. As such, Everyday Websites, LLC acts as a barrier between the content here and my personal holdings in the event of legal action. While everything I've stated here is based on facts as I understand them, I've seen the message boards with rather aggressive and sometimes outrageous minions of UFirst MMA Associates attacking anyone highlighting the deficiencies of the system. As my blog isn't worth much (and a lawsuit liquidating its assets wouldn't be devastating to my family), and I have this new level of protection, I feel compelled to highlight this article to my readers. Incidentally, I used the Company Corporation to form my LLC. For anyone publishing content in print or on the internet, I highly recommend you form one yourself. It's quick and easy and you'll sleep better at night. You may find that you're no longer inhibited in writing that scathing review next time that idea pops in your head. Here's the link:

To answer the opening question, I wouldn't go as far as classifying the Ufirst Money Merge Account as a scam, since they do provide enough transparency and disclosure to understand what the gaps are and the unnecessary nature of the system to investigative readers. However, I think it's completely unnecessary and was devised to intentionally appear sophisticated and useful, when all that's needed to accomplish the same result is some old-fashioned discipline.
Sources:
Company Website: http://www.u1stfinancial.com/
The video I referenced can be accessed from their website
[5/26/2008
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35 COMMENTS HERE
Interesting article, however, according to Warren Buffet 8-9% average annual returns from the stock market are a thing of the past. He thinks that future average yields will be much lower.
I got this pitched to me, since I'm a financial planner and the "agent" wanted me to promote this to my clients. It's not for me or my clients, but I do see some limited application in a lower-middle class or middle class family. Most people aren't that sophisticated financially, don't read blogs like yours or financial magazines, and don't usually maximize their IRA or 401k. Since a home is still the biggest block of net worth for most people at retirement, paying your mortgage down quickly "feels good" - and while logical financial minds don't use emotion to make decisions - for "real people" "feeling good" is what it's all about.
On the future market prediction, while Warren will always have a place in the investors' Hall of Fame, I wouldn't alter my investment strategy based on any one individual's predictions. It's interesting, but for every opinion from a respected economist or investor, there is a diametrically opposed opinion or prediction from an equally respected nobal laureate or some such figure. Soros thinks one thing, Buffet thinks another. We only have history to go off of.
I do agree that the US market may see different returns, because it's no longer a US centric world and things are changing; but global returns could potentially continue on the same path they have for years. These days, I view diversification of equity markets the same way our prior generation viewed diversification of stocks within the US market. Now, it's global diversification that's necessary.
Noah,
I Agree, that for a lot of people, the gimmick or the trick to get people to save, to stay out of debt, whatever it may be, can sometimes be worth forgoing other options that a more sophisticated investor or consumer would choose. I guess in the end, the question is "Is ANYONE well served with this program as opposed to just taking that $3800 and putting it right toward a pre-payment to begin with and then making extra payments out of their account" as opposed to the program doing it for them?
Featured at: http://www.moolanomy.com/597/carnival-of-personal-finance-155-time-with-family/
Great post! I, too, have been trying to educate people on why this program is not worth the money. UFF agents have been battling me, but have yet to come up with any substance to back up what they're saying.
Great post! I've been considering a money merge account for some time, so its good to hear the other side of the story.
I actually just started to prepay my mortgage this month by sending in extra principal payments.
Great site!!!
1st off, the .net website is reserved for its agents (the sellers). So if there were ANY complaints, that would be an appropriate practice. To add on, if I had a complaint with Ufirst, I wouldnt care if it was .net, .com or .org, I would recognize the Logo, enter my complaint and hit send, as would any one with a half a brain. Furtermore, if you did have a complaint, you register with the BBB by contact info ie, Corporate Name, Address, Phone, Contact, etc. That being said, to write a blog using the excuse that Ufirst is trying to Conceal its identity is a joke that fell on deaf ears of an intelligent person.
2nd, of all the blogger INFERS that the the "software" transfers money for you. FALSE. If you listen, it is very clear that the software is a Financial GPS, it only ADVISES you as to when the time is right to make such transfers and to deposit income. So, if you had a change in expenses or income, you have ALL CONTROL to adjust your numbers, which will recalculate your payoff information, and be reflected on your balance info. So the system DOES NOT AND CANNOT TRANSFER ANY FUNDS. Nor does the system ask for you SS#, Bank Account Info, or Mortgage, or HELOC info PERIOD.
3rd, who wouldnt want to NOT PAYOFF THEIR MORTGAGE, OR SIGNIFICANTLY REDUCE BALANCE FOR EQUITY based on the 30 year cost of the dollar. At the rate we are going now, my brand new home, built in 2006, has decreased in value, which makes a refi nearly impossible without 80-90% equity.
The system that is being used is similar to the system the banks use to take our money!! Anyone who cant see that should look up Australian and UK mortgage practices and write back.
Lastly, he is stating that paying $3800 (the software is actually $3500 more reason to believe this guy hasnt done his homework). Also, the cost of 3800 is 21,000 in 30 years. WOW. I would rather spend 3800 to pay down my balance effectively than to spend 231,000 in interest over 30 years. Especially when we are using the banks money to do it. NOT ONE TIME did this guy say, it doesnt work. Please write a blog with facts and information on how it doesnt work.
Thanks
Well Mr/Mrs. Anonymous, this blogger gave you a forum to voice your opinion. That's fair, right? I think all sides of the story should be heard and if I'm mistaken or my opinion is swayed, I'm not too proud to admit that, as I've done before.
Here are some rebuttals to your comments:
#1 Regarding your first point, I overtly stated that this was conjecture on my part and just found it to be curious - feel free to revisit: "While this is conjecture on my part, is it possible that the .net site is there to provide for a satisfactory rating with no complaints, while the .com site handles the transactions and could potentially be affected by a poor rating?", so it wasn't stated as "fact".
#2 - You're splitting hairs here. Whether the system actually transfers the money or advises you to transfer the money isn't really the point here. It was describing what the system's all about; the mechanism of action if you will. So, you've highlighted that it actually does even less than I stated in that there is manual management/action required. I'll gladly correct in the post, no actual change in concept.
#3 - With all due respect, I'm sorry, but if you're selling financial services to people, you should really have a better handle on financial concepts. Are you accredited in some way? This is the only financial product I'm aware of that can be sold by anyone and everyone. This one made no sense, "the 30 year cost of the dollar"? What does that mean? Are you referring to the future value of a dollar 30 years into the future? It's all about your discount rate, present value and future value. By pre-paying additional principal, you're effectively giving the bank an interest free loan on your capital rather than investing it or paying down higher interest debt (for instance, do agents advise Americans with credit card debt [majority] that pre-paying a mortgage at 6% PRE-DEDUCTION rather than paying down credit card debt at double digit rates would be a horrible waste of funds). Whether your home value is upside down or not is of no consequence; you're still in the hole by the same amount, right? If I put 0% down and pre-payed 20% or put 20% down on an interest only and payed no additional principal, I still have negative equity in the house if its value has declined 20% or more. No difference.
I noticed you didn't attempt to counter any of the quantitative arguments from the article, so you tell me, is this service really something people can't quite simply do themselves for free?
Bottom line: If this were a legitimate mechanism benefitting the public good, don't you think the major mortgage houses and financial advisors would be pushing this as the latest financial innovation? It's being peddled by "associates" with no financial credentials/licenses. It is what it is...unnecessary.
UK/Australia - I'm American so this is of no consequence to me. Are you telling me these guys are using home equity lines of credit and software to pre-pay mortgages? Feel free to add some links, but I don't see the relevance in a US mortgage amortization schedule how it matters what they're doing in other countries.
"Lastly" - "I would rather spend 3800 to pay down my balance effectively than to spend 231,000 in interest over 30 years. Especially when we are using the banks money to do it. NOT ONE TIME did this guy say, it doesnt work." This is completely mangled. First of all, you don't get to pay $3800 one day then magically your mortgage is payed off early! You're paying out additional principal in present dollars that could be 1) invested elsewhere at a higher rate of return or 2) be used for pre-payments if you see fit with simple discipline WITHOUT a $3500 fee and WITHOUT HELOC fees adding up to THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS over the life of the loan, even if shortened to 8 or 10 years. Anyone out there understanding present value/future value will agree that the $3500 and THOUSANDS in HELCO fees would be spent much more wisely elsewhere. On the notion: "NOT ONE TIME did this guy say, it doesnt work", it's not really logical to declare one way or the other that it doesn't WORK. I could say hopping on your left leg for 12 hours a day "works". Sure, you'll burn some calories, but there are certainly better uses of your time right? Take a jog and forego joint damage and a waste of 12 hours out of your day. Odd analogy, but any will do. The overriding theme here is that it is UNNECESSARY (that word appears 4 times in the post); whether it "works" or not is of no consequence.
3800 vs 3500; easy to update-I'll accept an error there. Did that really sway anyone's decision though?
One on the MMA agents links to a spreadsheet view that shows the MMA in action, year end mortgage balance. Comparing this to a spreadsheet I wrote to handle prepayments, I find that prepaying beats MMA by $6500, the cost of MMA plus interest over the 10.4 year example. The HELOC use doesn't add a dime's worth of savings, but if I tried to sell you a spreadsheet for $3500, you'd laugh. So the came up with the most remarkable hyperbole such as "I love the new factorial math which is used–now taking someone with a mortgage and 10 other debts, creating over 3 million possibilities of paying off, and the wrong one could cost you substantially. Yeah, I said 3 MILLION possibilities."
3 million? huh? Why not just take all your month end extra funds and pay your debt? Too easy?
Joe
EDF - Don't fall into the trap of saying paying down debt is is an "investment". It isn't. At best it is a cost reduction to the interest you are paying. A potential savings against expected future interest payments.
With an investment at the end of the day you have the investment plus the return.
For example, if I put $1 into a Treasury or Treasury money market at the end of the day I have the $1 plus interest. I can take out both. But if I send that $1 to pay down my debt I have no chance to get that dollar back! I may have reduced my future interest payments but I didn't get a "return" on that money. It's a sunk cost. I would have to incurr more debt to get that $1 back. A savings and a return aren't the same (unless I missed something in accounting class).
MP,
Whether paying down a 20% loan instead of attempting to invest at a substantially lower return is called an "investment" or a "prudent use of free cash flow" or whatever it's called, I think any reasonable financial analysis would favor paying down credit card debt at 20%+ over trying to invest it.
For instance, I saw people on Prosper.com looking to borrow money at 11% and saying they were going to invest it. I almost fell out of my seat. These are people taking out an 11% return and they think they can return more than that in the market? We're down 20% from last year...but I digress.
So, you're right that the definition of investment and debt reduction don't match up to a tee, but I think you'd agree with the concept in what the best move is for your money right?
I checked out your blog by the way; we have similar views on people taking on debt they can't handle. So, I assume we're aligned; just more of a definition thing.
MMA 4 is being pitched as the latest and greatest, using "millions of lines of code" and "multiple algorithms." In other words, they have come up with more ways to justify scamming people out of $3500 for something people can easily do themselves.
In addition to using a HELOC, they now use credit cards, as well as automating the do-it-yourself approach.
On a different blog, I showed one mortgage broker enthusiast how a simple debt snowball will equal MMA's performance and cost $10,000 less in interest. He still doesn't believe it and is looking every which way to justify his investment as an agent and client.
It amazes me how hard it is for people to understand how to beat compound interest with simple interest. This program is set up to speed the process of paying the mortgage and canceling as much compound interest as possible. As a single mom who has been on the product for over a year, I have seen remarkable progress in my payoff. It has made me more aware of my financial control and it has been very productive for me. This is a product of choice. There is no scam, just simply another option on how to save or use your money. People who put the product down don't really understand it and are possibly keeping people from something that could be productive for others, because of opinion rather than facts. I am on the product, as well as friends of mine, and we have had nothing but success from the UFirst. You get what you put into it. No, I could not pay off my home as quickly as I am if I had not gotten on U First. I have yet to find anyone that has been on U First to have anything negative to say about it. I have a hard time finding anything on the internet from anyone that has used the product to say it does not work either. As far as awards, it just was one of the west coasts winners of the Ernst and Young awards and is up for the National award. It has been featured on several Mortgage Magazines that have not ever indorsed products. This way of paying your mortgage is standard in many countries around the world. We are just getting the opportunity to get the knowledge of a better more effective way to take control of your own finances. If is doesn't work for you, then so be it. Just understand that it does for thousands of others in America with out complaint. It educated me and many others in my community. You get what you pay for and sometimes it takes money to make money. I paid $3,500 for a program to show me how to beat the most compound interest as possible on my mortgage. In the first year, by following the programs direction I paid enough equity in to my home and saved $12,000 in interest over the course of the loan. I think it paid for itself already and I have 7 more years to have it paid off by following the program. How do you argue that? I am sure you will find a way. I am very glad I did not read your article before being introduced to the product and now have great success on it. We wonder why the wealthy get wealthy and the poor stay poor. Our society teaches us to fear anything that could be good as well.
Hi CA,
I'm amazed that people don't consider the Present Value/Future Value concepts coupled with your mortgage interest rate/discount rate (cost of cash) as presented in the article before forking over $3500 for something they could do themselves if they so pleased. Have you added in the HELOC payments you're incurring and the opportunity cost of not investing that money elsewhere that you're plowing into a mortgage early? If you've identified any erroneous statements, calculations or otherwise in the post, please identify them and I'll gladly issue a retraction. Otherwise, I'll keep my $3500 and recommend that readers do the same!
Regards,
Dan
CA
I am glad that you are having success with MMA. It will do what it says and cost you at least $10,000 more for that privilege than doing it yourself. I have never seen the product, but the math it uses does not lie. And their hype about "factorial math" is just hype.
MMA is for the financially undisciplined, mathematically illiterate and intellectually lazy. If you don't know where all your money is going, then MMA is the product for you. If you had debt before using MMA, then it's no surprise that you think that MMA is working for you. MMA works by fooling you into thinking the "little" bit of interest that MMA pays to the HELOC and the big chunks of money it deposits into the mortgage is paying off the mortgage faster than you could have done it yourself. Since you have no other yardstick, you don't know that your total indebtedness is going up compared to doing it yourself.
Just because you think a product or program is not for you doesn't make it a scam. You do not know the principals of the company that produces the Money Merge Account. If this is so bad, why did they win an Entrepreneur of the Year Award from Ernst & Young. If this is such a scam, why did Mark Victor Hansen, author of The One-Minute Millionaire and co-author of Chicken Soup for the Soul sign up as an agent and purchase the program for himself. If you have to be an idiot to purchase the program, why is Doug Anderson, author of "Missed Fortune 101," and "The Last Chance Millionaire" supporting the UFirst program? Why did Personal Real Estate Investor Magazine give the company "the most innovative product of the year?" I am on the program since March of 2007 and I have paid off $23,000 in principal on my debt, at least $19,000 more than I would have on my own without any change in spending habits or lifestyle. Being the average consumer is neck deep in debt and given the state of the economy, it seems to me that this is a product whose time has come. If you rocket scientists out there are doing so well financially that you are able to prepay the principal of your debt outright, good for you! But for the average Joe, who is getting by, paycheck to paycheck, maybe this is something they can benefit from. No one slams the mortgage broker from charging thousands in fees to re-fi people so they can pay off their debts and re-pay all the interest they've already paid. Why would you have such strong opinions about a company that is trying to help people get out of debt?
I too have been using the Money Merge account and it works fantastic. I have appeared on CNN and ABC 7 in Los Angeles regarding the current crisis.I challenge you to solve this: mortgage 1- $94,500, 23 years left to pay. Using Money Merge account it pays off in 3.6 years. mortgage 2-$600,000 24 years left to pay. Money merge pays it off in 13.6 years. Oops! there was also an auto loan in that formula. The real key is my payment did NOT change nor did my budget. It is clear you are NOT familiar with the product or its POWER. As for your get a 15 year mortgage-GREAT if it was financially possible- most cannot due to the increased payment. Please use your do it yourself approach and help me formulate this scenario. I look forward to hearing from you.
So, CNN and ABC7 are hunting you down for interviews? Or you're out seeking photo ops while peddling this "system" since you're an agent? I AM familiar with the product. I had it pitched to me, researched it and found no benefit whatsoever.
What you didn't describe here to any degree is what this thing does for anyone that you couldn't simply do for yourself (minus the thousands in fees and the hundreds in HELOC fees per year). Can you please "familiarize" us? It doesn't create funds out of thin air to pay down these mortgages you cited. If I had free cash flow and felt like paying down a mortgage in advance, I could simply send additional payments each month. It's one of the sillier premises I've come across in a long time, especially for this price.
Let's talk disclosure: I have nothing to gain by criticizing it. You have "agent" sales to gain the more you push it, publicize it and try to kill the messenger.
No the TV shows were in reference to the current mortgage crisis. Its clear you distort the facts to benefit your daily blog. It also appears you are ill informed on the product. How did u get that I was seeking shows for the product based on what I wrote.
Anon,
You're really a piece of work. Distorting what facts? About your lame TV appearances??? You expect me to know the content of your TV appearance? YOU'RE THE ONE THAT MADE MENTION OF IT! And then you say I distort the facts. Then why did you even make mention of it in your comment? I have no idea what you're doing on TV; what is your motivation on even being on TV, to talk about your 600K mortgage?
The fact that you can't even articulate an actual benefit of the system over what anyone that isn't mildly retarded can do themselves (and some disclosure brother...how many of these sales have you peddled to friends and families...awaiting that answer) begs the question as to what TV stations are doing interviewing you. What are your credentials? Oh, I forgot, CNN gave an hour to Jenny McCarthy, "Nobel Laureate Scientist"/Playboy Playmate, to share her treatise on the true cause of autism, the giant consiparacy between the government, doctors and pharmaceutical companies and then told us how she "cured her son" of the condition with her motherly love and intuition. That's CNN, the beacon of objective reporting.
You bring up a good point EVERYDAY FINANCE. What are YOUR credentials? You seem to think you know what works better for all others. The fact that you and others claim it's EASY to do this yourself just points to your ignorance toward what is going on in the average family in America today. I like to gather opinions but in reading your review I failed to see where you actually used the software to see whether it was of value. That's what a true review is. Your review could have been shortened to "I'm not sure because I've never really seen it but I'm afraid of what I don't know so I wouldn't buy it."
Anon,
Maybe I am not understanding this but can you tell us how exactly this helps. The only thing I can figure is that it gives you access to a line of credit to cover the extra payment, if you do not have the funds. It then automatically makes the payment for you. The first seems like a poor use of credit. Why would I need something to tell me what I can figure out myself. If I have extra money I make an extra payment or I can just put a little extra aside each month. It is not that difficult unless you are borrowing to do so and then that is just a bad idea. The second just sounds like people are being lazy. So I don't really get it!!! Seems like a waste to me!!
What credentials do I need to criticize a system that you pay $3500 for that is unnecessary? You're missing the fact that I'm not actually selling a service or product. I'm questioning the value of it.
On whether or not I used the software, I sat through a presentation by a friend of a friend, I questioned the validity of the assumptions and value it provided and it was evident that there was NO benefit whatsoever in the product. I was provided with a mock website and simululation interface, etc. It was a bunch of hooey.
In fact, I am concerned over a program advocating taking on additional debt by way of Home Equity Lines of Credit to pre-pay a mortgage. If you're in tune with what's going on today with average Americans that you cite, did you know that average Americans are having their HELOCs rescinded? How's that work after you pay the $3500?
Credentials:
With a BS in Chemical Engineering (lots of advanced math), an MBA (math combined with finance) and years of investing experience (more math and my website is full of financial models to back up my assertions), my credentials are actually more applicable that probably 97% of the dopes selling this system, as there are NO requirements to do so, other than that you needed to fall for the ruse yourself first, then you're an associate like yourself.
Hello everyone. I am a former financial professional of 10 years and I consider myself fairly financially savvy.
I do not own the MMA product, however, I did "sign up" as an agent 2 years ago so that I could have access to additional information and training materials to determine the legitimacy of the product. Everything I was researching was "version 2" of the product and I am not familiar with versions 3 or 4 due to little, or should I say no, activity for the past 1.5 years.
I would like to share my opinion on a few items to stir up the pot a bit.
The first item relates to the banking principles of arbitrage. It goes without saying that when we deposit money with banks - we are lending them our money and it shows up as a liability to them. They are in the business of lending/investing the money they have borrowed from us in anticipation of earning a spread (profit) to increase their assets. Simple. That's Banking 101, right?
In my opinion, what every consumer needs to understand is how banks operate and in what circumstances we can apply these principles on a personal level.
Here are a few examples followed with tying it in with what MMA enthusiasts don't seem to argue properly:
- Lets say you have 2 credit cards. Both have a balance of $1000 and available limits of $5000. One is at 9% and the other is at 19%. Generally speaking, you are much better off transferring the balance of 19% to the card with a rate of 9% to cancel 10% in annual interest you would have otherwise paid. At this point, you would have a $2000 balance at 9% and you have increased your discretionary income via interest cancellation.
- Now, for the sake of the argument, lets say that you are certain that the credit card company will not lower your available balance. Hypothetically, you could take some or all of your paycheck and pay off the credit card that has a $2000 balance. Because this money will be applied to the balance as early as a few business days, you will no longer be owing interest. Most likely though, you still need the money you used to pay off the balance so what do you do? You continue to use the credit card as needed, but now you have a new window of time before you are being charged interest. Naturally, the balance in the card will go up and down, but the bottom line is that very few consumers are aware of some simple strategies like this that can limit that overall interest charges they are obligated to pay. These savings can either accelerate debt pay off or improve cash flow and lifestyle.
What most U First agents fail to point out is what happens with "effective" interest rates when certain strategies are implemented with the right financial vehicles. In the case of the credit card example, the rate was always 9%. However, this strategy alone can cause your monthly interest expense to be much lower than what it was before because you have caused your effective interest rate to improve.
Here is the kicker:
With a HELOC, because the "average daily balance" is affected by daily deposits and withdrawals, with this affecting the interest charges, the client utilizing the HELOC properly can cause a 7% HELOC to have an effective rate of, lets say, 3.5%.
Here is where I bring this full circle:
If you are borrowing money, "effectively", at 3.5% to pay off your first mortgage of 6%, you are now applying the banking principles of arbitrage similarly to the credit card example of using money at a cost of 9% to pay off 19%.
Therefore, the math/concept behind the MMA program works, but there are a whole lot of people purchasing the program that would be better off applying other strategies before they should ever consider pulling the trigger on the MMA software.
That being said, here are some final thoughts and opinions:
- Someone with little to no discretionary income doesn't have much business paying off their home. There are plenty of other things that should probably be in order.
- The biggest reason to use the software is to receive advise (prompts) on when to transfer funds from the HELOC to the 1st mortgage and how much to transfer. Therefore, anyone with a high enough balance, which is a lot of folks, will not be prompted to make a "transfer" until quite some time down the road and are better off not purchasing the software.
- There are certain circumstances in which the software is the right thing for the right person, but this is a small percent of those actually buying it. Only a true professional could help someone determine whether or not its for them.
- If you simply want to pay off your home and ignore all these other strategies on how to increase your net worth, then mathematically the MMA concept can do this faster.
Any rebuttals or things to clear up?
Anon,
Are you kidding me? Seriously, are you kidding me??
You speak of the normal middle class not having the ability to figure out when to place an extra $1000 toward their mortgage? If they have difficulty figuring how or when to come up with that $1000, how in the world are they going to come up with the $3500? If they can come up with that kind of cash, why not simply place it toward the principle themselves?
Do you offer an installment plan for the $3500? At what rate? I would hope 0% because anyone who would engage in an installment plan for this product could just as easily apply those payments to their mortgage instead. They win even more if this example installment plan you offer had a rate other than 0%.
More ways to accelerate payments to your mortgage:
1. Round up any payments to the next even $100.
2. Pay $100 extra a month.
3. Sign up with your bank for those twice monthly payment schedules. They generally tout that if you use this schedule, you'll essentially make 13 monthly payments in a full year. There's generally a fee for signing up for this schedule, but the fees are MUCH less onerous than UFirst's. And again, someone could simply make the payments themselves and save themselves the fee.
Seriously, how can you tout this stuff?
Hey Everyday Finance,
Test Question: from where does the money come from when you get a loan to buy a house?
Not sure I follow. Enlighten me.
Who's asset was the money that was loaned for the benefit of Joe Homeowner to payoff previous Homeowner?
I was recently approached with this program as well from a recent aquaintance through a B2B networking group I belong to and I was initially intrigued by it. I am doing the research on it and came across this blog, which to me is very typical of most things out there.
The arguments that are made against this program are all good ones and very valid. The only shortfall I see to it is that you put too much stock into the so called "average" American. We are the country filled with people who will stand in front of a microwave and yell "hurry up". Fast is not fast enough and cheap is not cheap enough. We cry about how the so called sweat shops in these third world countries are churning out J. Smith clothing so that we, the cheap American, can purchase it for under $15.00. Then the price goes up because we have to now follow American rules for a company in the foreign country and suddenly we won't buy it.
Americans as a whole are lazy, ignorant and selfish. You make a great argument that we could all do this as easily ourselves, and I guess that is why so many of us are doing it, right? You guys are, I am sure, already employing your own advice. Unless you have something pushing you to make those extra payments the average American will put that money elsewhere, like a flat screen t.v. (which, by the way, has no interest appreciation but seems to be the must have).
How many Americans are now in jeopardy of losing their homes, or have lost them, because they took an interest only, balloon payment or ridiculous variable rate mortgage without thinking? We just don't care about the future, it is all about the now. I do know several people who are working hard to pay down their mortgage, and honestly I have heard a couple of finance shows on the radio in the D.C. metro area that recommend paying down your mortgage, in order to have that huge bill off of their minds and freeing up the $1500.00 to $3000.00 a month. I personally see a benefit to having a mortgage and use the tax benefits of it to offset some of my income. I also see it as a long term investment much like an IRA. I can pay off my 200K home for 254K in 8 years, or whatever it would be, and sell it in 30 years for 450K or more. That would be more money in my pocket over the long run, I think anyway but I will let you finance geniuses tell me what it would really be.
As for the argument that you could use the money to pay off the higher interest rate debt, like credit cards or vehicles, first and then the house, YEAH RIGHT. I am sure that is exactly what is going on. We get our credit card bill every month and think, yeah I'll put an extra $1000.00 to this so I can pay it off early. NOT. We see the minimum payment and think, I can hardly afford that. Sure you can argue it all you want but it is constantly being proven how the minimum payment is the only thing being paid off, no matter how many times you show them how they will never get out of debt that way. As for the vehicles, Americans never pay those off early, they trade them in too often to see any value in that.
Again, I am not using UFirst and even after 10 years of saying I was going to put two extra payments a year to the principal of my mortgage I am still not doing it. I guess I am just a typical American. Maybe if I had someone every month reminding me to put that extra towards some of my debt I would actually do it. Maybe if I saw every month my debt dwindling away and had some sense of being in a better position this month compared to last month I might feel better about our current economic situation, or at the least feel more secure that I won't lose my house.
You have some great arguments for some people to go their own way, however every program out there has their target audience, just like those interest only loans. Spending months trying to belittle the program and it's members is really shallow and a waste of time. Go after the one's that need your attention; the lenders, the banks, the lawyers, the judges and the one's who created this mess that put most people into their current situation.
The company of UFirst will either succeed or fail by their own actions. If their program works for most people then they will succeed. If people feel they are being ripped off or they are not getting their money's worth then it will fail. Constantly attacking their program or people does nothing to help your position. Honestly, after the last several months of this, neither side has strengthened their position.
Just my two cents, which I guess would be worth about 32K in 30 years.
Hmm "Don't Care", sounds like you already have your mind made up, or perhaps already an agent? You don't sound like someone assessing the downside.
"I am doing the research on it and came across this blog, which to me is very typical of most things out there." Sorry there, most blogs actually conduct positive reviews and imbed affiliate links to garner sales off their reviews. You don't make any money from criticising a growing business concern. I do some of each, but have never conducted a pay-per-post, turning down thousands per year. So, this isn't your typical blog.
"As for the argument that you could use the money to pay off the higher interest rate debt, like credit cards or vehicles, first and then the house, YEAH RIGHT. I am sure that is exactly what is going on. We get our credit card bill every month and think, yeah I'll put an extra $1000.00 to this so I can pay it off early. NOT. We see the minimum payment and think, I can hardly afford that." - If you're advocating that these people that make minimum payments on their cards and carry a balance instead throw money at a mortgage with an effective tax rate of under 5%, you're nuts. They should pay down the 20-30% debt first.
"Spending months trying to belittle the program and it's members is really shallow and a waste of time." You give me too much credit. I wrote a single article.
"Just my two cents, which I guess would be worth about 32K in 30 years." - Blowing thousands in year 1 to save money in the future by being "reminded" to do something you could do yourself is not a good use of capital in my mind.
But then again, what are those fees you get on pitching this product to other people? I'm sure that more than makes up for it. Good luck!
MMA is for the financially undisciplined, mathematically illiterate and intellectual lazy.
It has been shown over and over again that MMA will cost thousands and thousands more than doing it yourself for a number of reasons:
1) Every 3 months or so, MMA forces you to borrow about 3 months worth of extra monthly payments from a HELOC, put that money towards your mortgage principal, and pay that loan down over the next 3 months. If the HELOC interest rate is greater than the mortgage, you end up paying more interest, not less, than doing it yourself.
2) MMA claims to use "interest cancellation" to reduce the HELOC balance by putting all income deposits into the HELOC and paying bills from the HELOC, instead of your normal checking account. The most interest you can save in any month is one month's income. According to MMA, most people only save about 1/3 of that. So you still end up paying a lot more extra HELOC interest
3) MMA will hijack all your credit payments by having you consolidate all loan balances into the HELOC, regardless what the interest rate is. You don't need MMA to do that.
Many ignorant UFirst salesmen will tell you that mortgages are front-loaded because of the small amount of principal that is paid each month. That is a lie. Each month, you pay interest on the previous month's outstanding balance. Then, enough principal is added to the payment to make each payment amount the same as the previous month.
Thank you for the "unbiased" analysis of the U First MMA. I was also approached to buy the $3,500 software as well as become an agent.
1)I was very skeptical because they could not give me a concrete explanation of how the "software" works. So you want me to spend $3,500 on something that you can't fully explain to me?
2)I was informed about the commission structure. My network marketing sponsors and myself would reap a total of $1,500 of the total $3,500 software fee...Hmmmm
3)I thought... If anything backfired in this system which has not gained nationwide credibility from reliable sources, would I be willing to shoulder that burden of helping someone get deeper in debt or lose their home? I DON'T THINK SO!!!
To EverydayFinance, I think you are being a little hard on your blog contributors at times.
In defense of 'don't care' I appreciate what you had to say and I mostly agree. After all, it was just your 'take' on society today.
As for me, I attended a UFirst seminar and was hooked like a fish. I am one who always researches things prior to making a decision, except in this case. That was my mistake. It has only been a few days since making my payment, and I am not setup with their software yet, but I did my 'late' research and am now trying to get my money back. They say my right of rescission period has passed and I am out the money. Time will tell. I am confident that I can achieve the same outcome, financially speaking, without the software and the expense incurred to acquire it. Hopefully this will be a cheap lesson learned for myself.
First of all, thank you for your comments. And it's regrettable that you're locked in and they won't refund the money even though you don't have the software yet. I guess this provides some insight into the type of outfit you're dealing with.
Regarding my treatment of anonymous posters posing as ecstatic consumers of this service who are really multi-level marketers reaping significant commissions from each person like yourself:
Why's it cost so much? A huge MLM commission schedule?
I just can't allow commentors on this board to try and sneak in the glory stories under the guise of anonymous posting without going unchallenged. I feel readers deserve to hear both sides, not just the MLM "agents" trolling the boards for any sign of dissent.
When I'm wrong, I'm wrong-I correct factual errors if they arise and I routinely post on investing mistakes I've made (see my twitter this week on missing the oil bottom). Some of the posters above took shots at me or tried to distort my comments, but have yet to formally rebut a single thing I stated about the lack of utility and the cost/benefit of this service.
Thanks for you article. The concerns you point out about the program are helpful. I wonder though why it's not a good thing to go ahead and pay off one's mortgage? If I pay off my mortgage, I could then put the entire money I have been paying for my mortgage into an investment that would hopefully have the return of an average of 7% like you mentioned. But if I keep my mortgage for the entire term, I see it as I would only make 2% interest on my investment while I pay off my mortgage (7% gain minus 5% interest being paid on mortgage).
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